|The Opinion of Experts on the Two Lucys
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Hi Dr. Horvat,
I am the former Novus Ordo Catholic who wrote to you a couple of weeks ago [click here].
Since then, I have had five more professional photographers examine the [six sets of] pictures of Sister Lucy 1 and Sister Lucy 2 [click here].
None of the photographers has any interest in Fatima one way or another (one is Jewish, another agnostic, etc, etc).
All five of them ALSO have concluded that the two women are NOT the same person. One of them, a co-worker of mine, burst out laughing when he saw the two women side by side, and told me, "My five year old son could tell you that those are not the same person." That's pretty strong.
Dr. Horvat, I am trying to find a forensic anthropologist to look at these photos just to be doubly-sure. If I am able to afford the person's fee, whatever it may be, I will have him or her examine the pictures as well. But so far, every professional to whom I have shown the photos agrees that the two women are different people.
Chiefly, the giveaways are the eyes, nose, lips, jaw, and chin.
The Dimond Brothers website also has an article up dealing with the fact that the two Lucy's are not the same person.
Dear Tradition in Action,
While surfing the net I came across Dr. Horvat’s article on the Sister Lucys. As a practicing general dentist with advanced education in dentoalveolar surgery, I can testify that prosthetic teeth (dentures, crowns, bridges) while changing the esthetic and functional aspect of the dentition, will not change the muscles of facial expression.
Even with poorly fabricated appliances, the muscles that make up your "Smile Line” create dimples, and form rette's would not change. Even with chin and zygomal implants, the shape of the persons smile is only slightly affected.
I work in a dental center that has multiple practitioners. They all concur, these are two different people.
Thank you for bringing this to the public eye.
Mary Help of Christians....Pray for us!
M.S. - DMD
Should We Go to Forensic Experts?
Given the stunning evidence of a fake "Sr. Lucy" for so many decades, wouldn't it be possible to hire a forensic expert to make an authoritative judgment on the matter? We could even take up a collection to pay for it.
This is very important, for we will have the Vatican modernists on the run if we can prove that they were lying to us since 1958!
What Happened to the Sister Lucy I?
Well, after studying the photographs of Sister Lucy I and II [click here], I have concluded that they ARE NOT the same person for sure! If this is the case, then what happened to the real sister Lucy?
If the second Sister Lucy is passed off as the original ... then one may conclude that it was done intentionally to mislead the faithful.
The devil never sleeps.
Please Tell Us whether Sister Lucy I Is Alive
Dear Brethren in Christ:
I believe your claim in the 2 Sister Lucys but if the old Lucy is NOT the young one, may I ask what do you think (just an opinion please) happened to the real Lucy?
Do you think its possible that she is still alive or probably killed by the infiltrators?
Please share a logical view.
God bless you always.
The Editor responds:
Dear Mr. R.T., Mr. A.M. and Mr. M.D.
Thank you for your inquiries. I understand your concerns and share analogous perplexities.
1. In order to be serious and logical, we should consider that we are still in the stage of discussing whether there are actually two persons. In principle, only when this point is unanimously accepted should we go further.
2. After Dr. Horvat's last article on the topic, we have no longer received serious arguments from readers defending that both sets of photos are of the same person.
We have only received collateral objections diverting the analysis away from those pictures. For example:
* "What you are doing is the same thing some persons did with pictures of Paul VI trying to prove that there were two Paul VIs, one good and the other bad, the latter being the one who promoted the Council and the New Mass."
* "You are trying to prove that there are two Sister Lucys just because you don't like the New Mass and she used to go to it."
* "How it could be that Sister Lucy was substituted for another, since the new one would have to face members of her family, who were frequently with her?"
* Or ironical statements like this: "O.K. So, we really have two Sister Lucys, the Pope is a heretic, and the See of the Roman Pontiff is vacant. Is this what you want?"
None of these objections, however, addresses the question of how, with age, the bones of a woman's face, her eyes, the curve of her brows, the shape of her nose, the form of her smile and the protuberance of her chin can all change as shown in the photos analyzed by Dr. Horvat.
We are still waiting to see if any serious arguments will come forth.
3. How should the investigation be continued? Let each one make his analysis of the facts and photos and come to his conclusion. Each of us has seen persons aging and can form his own reasoned opinion.
Some readers are suggesting that we should go to a forensics specialist to give a final veridict. Even though I respect the opinion of specialists and welcome them when they are spontaneous and not concerned about jeopardizing their reputations and careers, I disagree that we should allow the decision on this topic to rely principally on their opinions. I much prefer to depend on the common sense of Catholics.
What is my reason for that? I am almost sure that if there are two Sister Lucys - as I am convinced there are - the same ecclesiastical forces who have tried to impose on Catholics that there is only one Sister Lucy will have no trouble finding much more famous experts to say the opposite. They might also even try to "convince" the first specialists to reverse their opinions, alleging some technical error. That is, to base such a question of universal concern on the opinion of a few experts is to weaken it.
Besides, if we go to specialists, the discussion leaves the realm of common sense accessible to all Catholics. It enters a technical field with a language that only few can understand. For these reasons, I consider that the opinion of an expert, which in principle should strenghten the truth if honesty prevails, in this concrete case could well weaken the possibility of a fraud becoming publicly manifest.
I positively prefer to rely on the common sense of Catholics. This explains how the discussion may continue.
4. Now, addressing your point: What if there were two Sister Lucys?
The classical questions come to mind: Who would have done it? Why? When? Where? How?
Even if I am working just with hypotheses, it is certainly legitimate to raise possibilities in response to the Who? Why? and When? Here is my guess, which I share with you.
John XXIII was Pope in 1960 when the Third Secret should have been revealed. There is a famous statement attributed to him, in which he said that the message of Fatima was not for our times. This personal judgment would have been the reason the revelation of the Third Secret was not made. So, if there was a faithful Sister Lucy trying to speak to the world and spread a message from Our Lady in opposition to his opinion, she would need to be silenced.
Regarding the Where? and How? at present I lack information to make any hypothesis worthy of consideration. Therefore, I don't know whether she is alive or not.
5. What I know is that Our Lady promised that she would appear in Fatima seven times, and she only appeared six times. Perhaps she will come a seventh time to answer all these questions and clarifiy so many mysteries. I pray daily for that.
This is what occurs to me at this moment to answer you as well as other concerned readers. I hope it is of some assistance.
Posted May 9, 2006
Other Articles in the Polemic
Forebodings about the Death of Sister Lucy
Two Sister Lucy's of Fatima
Wildfire Spreading Over Sister Lucy's Photos
You are Conspiracy Maniacs
The Controversy Grows
Photos and Facts
Readers Concur on Two Sister Lucys
The Anathemas of John Grasmeier
Compliments for Guimaraes' Response to John Grasmeier
Readers Against John Grasmeier
Readers Raise More Questions
Sister Lucy at the Word Processor
Photographic Studies Confirm Two Sister Lucys
Mysteries Around the Two Sister Lucys
Related Works of Interest
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